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sid-mattMatt Frazier and Sid Garza-Hillman have teamed up to produce plant-based meal plans that are designed to get us to the point where we no longer need meal plans.

There’s a lot to unpack in that goal:

  • getting from dependence to independence
  • figuring out the steps to get us there
  • designing a community to support all the members
  • and much more…

I interviewed Matt, the No Meat Athlete, a couple of years ago. I remember that call well because I was using my cell phone, getting awful reception, but really enjoying the walk around my front yard while getting to know Matt.

Sid, I just found out about through his collaboration with Matt. As soon as I checked out his resume and podcast, I realized that not being familiar with his work put me in the “living under a rock” category in the plant-based world. He’s a true rockstar of knowledge and experience.

I signed up for their meal-plan service, not so much for myself (give me a plan and I guarantee I will do the opposite), but to learn from them and to evaluate their service for my students and clients.

And the thought, design, and philosophy that runs through their offering was truly impressive. So I decided to get them on the horn (isn’t that more poetic than “we Skyped”?) to find out what they were thinking.

In our conversation, we covered:

  • Sid’s diet-led recovery from asthma
  • not being successful as a nutritionist, and what it taught him
  • why “Biggest Losers” inevitably gain the weight back
  • why people want meal plans (I thought of one reason, but was surprised to hear the second)
  • meal plans vs decision fatigue and conscious incompetence
  • habit change: willpower taxation vs repetition
  • “sleep in your running clothes”
  • the wrong way to go about habit change: “take on too much and burn out too fast”
  • lions don’t have to decide between Italian and Mexican food
  • the curse of the perfectionist mindset
  • dramatic change as a trailing indicator of internal transformation
  • how militancy in diet standards contributes to stress, not health
  • the difference between an “Earthlings” vegan and a “Forks Over Knives” plant-based eater
  • clarity: the missing ingredient in motivation
  • Matt’s stages of dietary change – slow and deliberate and tentative
  • moderation, license to sin, and appropriate boundaries
  • Sid’s focus on Natural: “We’re animals dressed up as people”
  • Life extension hacks vs simple lifestyle changes
  • the debate about caloric restriction
  • the key question for changers: “What am I able to take on right now?”
  • Sid’s 12-banana smoothies and the debate over dietary purity
  • the other key question for changers: “Does it make me happy?”
  • and much more…

Enjoy, add your voice to the conversation via the comment box below, and please share – that's how we spread our message and spread our roots.


Matt and Sid's Meal Plan Community

No Meat Athlete on amazon

Sid Garza-Hillman's website (including his podcast)

Approaching the Natural on amazon

Lindsay Nixon's blog post about caloric restriction

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Big thanks to the person who did not give me a rude gesture as I drove the wrong way to the gas station pump this morning, and to the following Plant Yourself Podcast patrons:

  • Kim Harrison
  • Lynn McLellan
  • Anthony Dissen
  • Brittany Porter
  • Dominic Marro
  • Elizabeth Clifton
  • Barbara Whitney
  • Tammy Black
  • Amy Good
  • Amanda Hatherly
  • Mary Jane Wheeler
  • Ellen Kennelly
  • Melissa Cobb
  • Rachel Behrens


Check out my online TV show, Triangle Be Well. This week I answer questions about gut health, and transitioning away from a meat-centered diet. Watch it here.

I can help you navigate the medical system and adopt a healthy lifestyle

I'm available for one-on-one consulting and coaching to help you navigate the medical system, make informed decisions, take control of your health destiny, and achieve true wellness and not just medical management of disease.

Ask your questions or share your feedback

Comment on the show notes for this episode (below)
Call 919-794-3735 to leave a voicemail

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Visit Howard Jacobson's health consulting site,
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The Plant Yourself Podcast theme music, “Dance of Peace (Sabali Don),” is generously provided by Will Ridenour, a kora player from North Carolina who has trained with top Senegalese musicians.

It can be found on his first CD, titled Will Ridenour.

You can learn about Will, listen to more tracks, and buy music on his website,


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2 comments on “Matt Frazier and Sid Garza-Hillman on the Sane and Happy Path to Change: PYP 154

  1. Thank You says:


    What a great stories, love podcasts like these.

    Thank You for another informative podcast; keep them coming.

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